You can hit from Pitch perhaps, maybe but why would you want to? Your Right Elbow would have to move back behind the hands very quickly during Release to pull it off. If your intention is to Push , Thrust why Align your Right Elbow in front of the Hands in a Pull position so late in the swing? You've also loaded along the wrong line, Reverse #2 pp against the Top instead of #1PP (and maybe #3pp, Direct Drive) against the Aft.
That said there are these Hitters who get late (ish) with some #2 Angle even but have their Right Elbows positioned to Push or Thrust. Lynn does this I believe. Ive got some photos somewhere. Drag then Drive Hitting. To the casual observer it can look a lot like a swing but it isn't. You've got to look at the Elbow position.
It can be a very elegant Hitting procedure .......or in Arnie's case brutish. That guy was strong. And long.
We're not talking 12-1 any more here ... this isn't Drive Loading. But it is Hitting. If you have 12-1 at one end of the spectrum and 12-2 at the other ......there's a lot of middle ground. But its best to master 12-1 and 2 before moving on . Start off compensation free and pure. Luke did when he re built his swing. Id say it turned out pretty good too..... Didn't take that long either.
How do you square your statements with....
Right Forearm Position at the Top differs for the Angle and Arc of Approach procedures. So their Elbow location and action differs also. For Hitting (10-19-A), the Right Forearm should be precisely in-line with – and directly opposed to – the motion of the On Plane Loading Action (7-22) of the entire Primary Lever Assembly (6-A) not just the Clubshaft, and this alignment is maintained through Impact (2-J-3, 4-D). For Swinging (10-19-C) the Right Forearm should be precisely in-line with – and directly opposed to – the motion of the On Plane Loading of the Secondary Lever Assembly (the Clubshaft) and this alignment maintained through Impact. In compliance with both 6-B-3-0-1 and 10-11-0-3. With this “in-line” relationship of Loading and Right Forearm, it is absolutely MANDATORY that, Hitting or Swinging, it is the Right Forearm – not just the Right Hand and/or Clubshaft – that must be thrown, or driven, into Impact per 7-2-3
So what would be the implications of having this small of a pulley THIS LATE? I don't know nothing about Trackman...but it sure does seem like there is a lot of "Down" Vertical Swing Plane or whatever them cats call it to make up...Plus the clubhead is NOT thrown out to the ball at this point....so it seems like you'd be "swinging out on it" more or more positive horizontal swing path or whatever...and how do you not have some big ole shaft lean and with a driver no less....and your shoulders are closed...so your right shoulder geometry ain't working OUT and FORWARD to the ball ...yet....so seems like the tendency would be to swing under and out and raise the handle/shaft up off the plane ...because of the vertical motion of the right shoulder?
you're the physics cat...you swing the weight on the string...don't the weight want to fly out? Why delay the weight slinging out that long? You love it...but for what reason? Cuz it looks purty? Or because it is functional? If the clubhead were more out to the ball at this point...what would you be giving up in terms of MPH? What would you potentially gain in terms of hitting the ball where you is looking?
I am going to try and answer all with one YouTube clip:
Make that two:
HB
Last edited by HungryBear : 01-06-2012 at 07:03 PM.
I am going to try and answer all with one YouTube clip:
Make that two:
HB
This is the answer? .... what's the title of these videos? How To Be A Handle Raising Under Plane Wrist Rubber?
Sorry man but this is TERRRRRRRRIBLE.....
Right shoulder has STALLED...face has rolled to the ground....looks like a great idea....if you want to hit it really low and you don't care where it goes...
__________________
Aloha Mr. Hand
Behold my hands; reach hither thy hand
Last edited by 12 piece bucket : 01-06-2012 at 10:43 PM.
you're the physics cat...you swing the weight on the string...don't the weight want to fly out? Why delay the weight slinging out that long? You love it...but for what reason? Cuz it looks purty? Or because it is functional? If the clubhead were more out to the ball at this point...what would you be giving up in terms of MPH? What would you potentially gain in terms of hitting the ball where you is looking?
From a pure physics point of view the closer the shaft and clubhead to your body, the lower the MOI with respect to say the spine axis so the easier it is to keep accelerating with the pivot (same a a skater spinning with arms close to the body vs extended). Of course at some point that rotational speed need to be transferred to clubhead speed so timing becomes more and more critical as you keep clubhead lag later and later in the swing.
From a pure physics point of view the closer the shaft and clubhead to your body, the lower the MOI with respect to say the spine axis so the easier it is to keep accelerating with the pivot (same a a skater spinning with arms close to the body vs extended). Of course at some point that rotational speed need to be transferred to clubhead speed so timing becomes more and more critical as you keep clubhead lag later and later in the swing.
fair enough....but the clubhead has to get OUT to the ball...what is being demonstrated here is the HANDS AND CLUB going OUT to the ball NOT the clubhead...the clubshaft isn't CLOSE to the spine axis the HANDLE IS MOVING AWAY from him...so the clubshaft would be rising quickly through the ball with the left wrist only able to uncock and arch....
Bottom line what you say may be correct...but I submit...this AIN'T the way to do it...
Right shoulder has STALLED...face has rolled to the ground....looks like a great idea....if you want to hit it really low and you don't care where it goes...
I suspect that Mr Doyle wouldn't want his student to look like this, his left arm is bent and head far behind. He has a series of videos on his site with a student that seems more centered and have a straight left arm. Here's Rick Nielsen, GSEM, swing, he studied under Ben Doyle and Gregg McHatton
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that's the best way to swing, little do I know !
you're the physics cat...you swing the weight on the string...don't the weight want to fly out?
I don't think strings- thay are bad
Why delay the weight slinging out that long?
The "sling out" is down plane and done from the pivot when the hands command. You must have a well trained pivot in yout computer for your hands to use. example- you walk to a door and open it as you pass through.- you think not about your walking but you assess the door, knob left or right, door open in or out. without a thought we walk to position the hands require for the job and we go through the door with hardly a pause, even if the door sticks we have hand feedback to put a little pivot against the door.
You love it...but for what reason? Cuz it looks purty? Or because it is functional?
I have a couple of requirements for the machine:
a.The left wrist only cocks and uncocks and forms a flat triangular plane, left shoulder, left wrist. center clubface. LFW
b.RFFW is fixed plane, not adjustable only movable. Right elbow, to right wrist to club head.
THERE IS NO "WIBBLE-WOBBLE" in this assembly.
There are circles within circles, shoulder plane, hand plane, club shaft plane, rotation of LFW to accomodate hinge, RFFW to on plane with and along plane/ plane line.
If the clubhead were more out to the ball at this point...what would you be giving up in terms of MPH? What would you potentially gain in terms of hitting the ball where you is looking?
Never thought about that???? Let me ask the question. If I hit the ball with a flat left wrist, lag pressure point and a straight plane line How can it go elsewhere?
Thats the machine- NO WIBBLE-WOBBLE allowed
HB
Last edited by HungryBear : 01-07-2012 at 02:30 PM.
Thats the machine- NO WIBBLE-WOBBLE allowed
Let me ask the question. If I hit the ball with a flat left wrist, lag pressure point and a straight plane line How can it go elsewhere?
HB
It can go anywhere if you don't account for the clubface...it's a HINGE ACTION of a circular motion on an inclined plane...so just because you have a lag pressure point and a flat left wrist and a straight plane line...that don't account for all the variables if you raise the handle and have the face rolling to the ground.....
It can go anywhere if you don't account for the clubface...it's a HINGE ACTION of a circular motion on an inclined plane...so just because you have a lag pressure point and a flat left wrist and a straight plane line...that don't account for all the variables if you raise the handle and have the face rolling to the ground.....
Got it- Flat left wrist-clubface- used wrong
lag pressure point-club shaft- used wrong
straight plane line- club head used wrong
who knows where the ball will go.
I get it now.
You know if the handle come UP the plane is bent, roll the left wrist and the clubface is gone, etc. I said NO WIBBLE_WOBBLE there - all fixed
Believe- what you see in the TW pix is square clubface, horizontal hinge , no wibble-wobble, slightly forward lean at impact, very good squareing the clubface early.
HB
Last edited by HungryBear : 01-07-2012 at 05:39 PM.
Got it- Flat left wrist-clubface- used wrong
lag pressure point-club shaft- used wrong
straight plane line- club head used wrong
who knows where the ball will go.
I get it now.
You know if the handle come UP the plane is bent, roll the left wrist and the clubface is gone, etc. I said NO WIBBLE_WOBBLE there - all fixed
Believe- what you see in the TW pix is square clubface, horizontal hinge , no wibble-wobble, slightly forward lean at impact, very good squareing the clubface early.
HB
Fair enough....you like the super models... but fat chicks need love too.... one man's sexy is another man's fugly....that eldrick picture don't do much for me....
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