Where does HK relate a DS plane shift to "Pivot Controlled Hands"?
hb
He doesn't say that. I believe that without an Aiming Point on or near the ball, you are using Pivot Control. But, because of 10-23-B, it's clear that HK is saying you can get to the elbow plane vertically with PP #3 and still use an Aiming Point.
Q2...yes dingdong you answered your question in your prior post...arc and angle of approach ARE VISUAL EQUIVALENTS..
Well at least someone is replying to my posts! Even if its me. At least I don't start going back and forth with myself or arguing with myself like you do sometimes.
"At the top of the Backstroke – even at End (10-21-C) – mental construct a line form the #3 Pressure Point to the Aiming Point."
he specifically says "top", not "Top", which makes me think the mental straight line construction AND the thrust is at the top, even if it's the End, and not the Top. After all, you hardly have time to mentally construct anything once the DS is under way. Also, thrusting from the End would deflect the straight line effort to start from the Top automatically.
Thanks Joe
Thing is Homer never showed a photo of the straight line hand path beginning at End. End being anything above Top , right shoulder high. Some guys have their hands way up over top of the their head at End. For them to get back to Top a place from which they can drive straight line they have to retrace the top arc. In so doing their hands move BACKWARDS (not forwards) Down and Out . From Top however they move FORWARDS DOWN AND OUT. Thats a critical difference , perhaps accounting for why Homer depicted straight line Hand Paths as commencing from Top at the highest.
To thrust straight line from an End where your hands are above your head say would be very cramped assuming a straight line hand path . You'd have to bend your left arm there by losing radius width. It'd have a super steep angle of attack.
Aiming Point Procedure , Thrust is a Right Arm Action . Hitting or Swinging , Actively or Passively the Right Arm is always Driving. Put another way to my mind, the right arms motion swinging or action hitting is very much a throwing like motion . Where does it throw towards , thrust towards ? The Aiming Point. This thrusting drives the circular orbit of the club head.
Quote:
6-C-2-A THE ESSENCE of Clubhead Lag technique is that it is always both Aiming AND Thrust. Passive – it is primarily Aiming the Lag Pressure. Active – it is the primarily Thrusting the Lag Pressure Point. The Orbiting Clubhead does not seek out the Ball – it seeks out the Delivery Line. But never directly – only via the Right Forearm and the #3 Pressure Point per 2-F, 5-0 and 7-3. It is guided along that Line to the Both Arms Straight configuration by the straight line thrust of the #3 Pressure Point toward the Angle of Approach quadrant of the Ball – or Aiming Point – per 1-F, 1-L-9/10, 2-J-3 and 6-E-2.
Quote:
Summing up the Right Arm action - it is always a straight line effort and/or motion and normally is strictly Clubhead Control. In the meantime the Flat Left Wrist (Clubface Control) under every condition or situation is concerned only with arriving at Impact, Vertical to the ground in the process of executing the selected Hinge Action. So, per 1-F the Hands are correlated but independent of every other factor." Practice every phase, over and over until mastered.
The ball is always moved fore or aft on the Plane Line when adjusting for different clubs.
Could be on the delivery line to...all delivery lines include the ball and the aiming point if need be....so you can be aft/forward on the delivery line as well.
Thing is Homer never showed a photo of the straight line hand path beginning at End. End being anything above Top , right shoulder high. Some guys have their hands way up over top of the their head at End. For them to get back to Top a place from which they can drive straight line they have to retrace the top arc. In so doing their hands move BACKWARDS (not forwards) Down and Out . From Top however they move FORWARDS DOWN AND OUT. Thats a critical difference , perhaps accounting for why Homer depicted straight line Hand Paths as commencing from Top at the highest.
To thrust straight line from an End where your hands are above your head say would be very cramped assuming a straight line hand path . You'd have to bend your left arm there by losing radius width. It'd have a super steep angle of attack.
Aiming Point Procedure , Thrust is a Right Arm Action . Hitting or Swinging , Actively or Passively the Right Arm is always Driving. Put another way to my mind, the right arms motion swinging or action hitting is very much a throwing like motion . Where does it throw towards , thrust towards ? The Aiming Point. This thrusting drives the circular orbit of the club head.
Thank you, OB, for making a lot of good points, which have convinced me that my understanding of Aiming Point is apparently limited to a Swing with top = Top and a single plane DS!
The only extra I would add to your AP procedure is that I want to make sure the downward thrust is from the shoulder ONLY - no adding, and feel like my passive arms are being pulled out of the shoulder sockets by the pivot thrust.
"At the top of the Backstroke – even at End (10-21-C) – mental construct a line form the #3 Pressure Point to the Aiming Point."
he specifically says "top", not "Top", which makes me think the mental straight line construction AND the thrust is at the top, even if it's the End, and not the Top. After all, you hardly have time to mentally construct anything once the DS is under way. Also, thrusting from the End would deflect the straight line effort to start from the Top automatically.
HOWEVER, you are absolutely right about plane shifts and the Aiming Point, because of the text on pg 202, in 10-23-B. Angled Line:
"From the Top-of-the-Straight-Line hand position the Hands take a nearly vertical path to the Plane of the Elbow Angle before they start their drive directly at and through the Aiming Point (2-J-3)."
I can't explain this apparent contradiction.
....if your procedure is based on a derived delivery line/arc/angle of approach...or .... straight up plane line....the aiming point is contained in the inherent geometry of your selected procedure...it can the ball, forward or aft of the ball with the aiming point and ball both lying on the selected geometric procedure line arc whatever procedure you pick....your "straight line" feel may be different for an arc of approach procedure than linear delivery...your feel may be more rounded if you are swinging on a flatter plane ....different for wheel rim vs. wheel spoke....if you are hitting on an elbow plane vs a TSP...your thrust may emanate from a different point on your torso....the right shoulder is a dual agent....but is it the "point of the shoulder" or your torso? For example on the elbow plane hitting ...your gonna likely feel the force emanate from lower in your rib cage...where as with the TSP hitting procedure you'll likely feel the force emanate from the backstop more up in your right pectoral area.... basically it is YOUR procedure and YOUR feel...YOUR aiming point...place it where it works for you....if you don't dig it ...ditch it...
HOMER .... WAS ..... ABOUT.....OPTIONS
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Last edited by 12 piece bucket : 05-17-2012 at 09:11 PM.
Thank you, OB, for making a lot of good points, which have convinced me that my understanding of Aiming Point is apparently limited to a Swing with top = Top and a single plane DS!
The only extra I would add to your AP procedure is that I want to make sure the downward thrust is from the shoulder ONLY - no adding, and feel like my passive arms are being pulled out of the shoulder sockets by the pivot thrust.
Sounds like swinging....could be entirely different for hitting though...
Sounds like swinging....could be entirely different for hitting though...
Yup. Exactly. Hitters would "add" . Add Right Arm Thrust to push the Primary Lever and extend the Right Arm to Both Arms Straight. Bent Right Arm at Impact , straight Right Arm at Follow Through. There's some magic in that. Magic that Swingers have a harder time learning unless they've goofed with Hitting.
We're into the left sided view of the swing vs the right sided view . Thing is the two are not mutually exclusive they co exist in the same motion. Some swingers will never see the Aiming Point deal cause its totally outside of their left sided perspective of the swing.. The Primary Lever, the Swingers Flail , uncork and roll the club head passing the hands etc vs the Right Side view of the bent Right Hand staying in front of the Clubhead etc etc.
Ideally IMO, "passive " Armed Swingers (passive except for the non accelerating thrust of Extensor Action) throw out the #2 and roll the #3 consciously (the Flail) but in the process also passively throw out the Right Arm to full extension at Follow Through. If they're not they should be. This Throwing like Motion (swinging) or Action (hitting) has a target , the Aiming Point.
The Aiming Point is a right sided deal. Loaded with Lag Pressure mere motion can feel like an action. Some swingers when they discover this can think they've slipped into hitting. OMG! Yoda went to Homer with a similar predicament back in 1982. He knew he was Swinging in all manners but wondered about a new found appreciation or consciousness of his Right Arm's throwing like motion. "Im sending bullets out there" . "I feel exactly like a base ball pitcher". But was this right arm deal passive or active? Was it Swinging , Hitting or Right Arm Swinging? In the end I believe Homer concluded it was Swinging with Pitch Basic Elbow . Pitch being called pitch for a reason. Its a throwing like motion. Loaded with Lag it does feel heavy and action like even if its only mere motion.
"Swinging or Hitting the Right Side is always Driving."
Let me explain how I teach an Aiming Point procedure. Construct a straight line from the hands to a point on the plane line. The right hand and arm should thrust/straighten forcefully, directly toward the aiming point. The ball will be long gone while the thrust continues. The aiming point should be where the right arm POINTS to when it should become straight, after the right hand passes the left shoulder. We're talking a couple of feet past the left foot on the plane line.
This procedure is a "feel", not so "real". Do the hands actually travel linearly to the aiming point? Hell, no! The hands travel in a circular arc through the impact zone, and as Joe has correctly poited out, are actually already on the way up and in while the clubhead is still on its way down and out. But does this procedure work wonders for keeping the clubhead descending to the left shoulder? Oh, hells yeah!
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