Question about plane

[Daryl]

Sorry if I'm misunderstanding your post , I can be totally vapidiculous sometimes.

What most seems missing is the idea that the Clubshaft Angle is the Plane Angle. Whatever the Angle of the Clubshaft, is the Plane angle. The Plane board should be set to the angle of the Clubshaft not the Clubshaft set to the Plane board. You should swing up and down the same angle of inclination of the Clubshaft. Your Hands and Grip control the Angle of the Clubshaft.

All of the various Plane Angles we talk about are reference points for the Clubshaft Angle. That Angle defines the Angle of the Plane.

Therefore, when at Impact, the Clubshaft extends through your waist where it's touched by your right elbow, then we say that the Clubshaft is on an Elbow Plane. If, at Impact, the Shaft Extends through the Location of your Right Shoulder where it was at the Top of your Backswing while using a Flat Backstroke Shoulder Turn, then we say that your Clubshaft is on a Turned Shoulder Plane.

The Quest, Nirvana, Valhalla, The Holy Grail, is to have a Swing where the Right Shoulder, Hands, Right Elbow, and Right Forearm are on the same Plane as the Clubshaft during Startdown; and at Release, the Hands Right Elbow and Right Forearm are on the same Plane as the Clubshaft for and through the Impact Interval as the Power Package Unfolds to Both Arms Straight. Curiously, this can ONLY occur if your Clubshaft angle is set to the Turned Shoulder Plane. But, unfortunately, even that’s not enough. You need a Hip Slide to help the Right Shoulder follow that plane during the Start of the Downstroke.

In the Picture above, Hogan appears to have his Clubshaft On Plane. However, it’s not the same plane he’ll have the Clubshaft on when the Ball is struck. I know this because his Right Elbow is Over-Bent and the Clubshaft Angle will flatten as he unfolds his Right Arm. Currently, his shaft is very close to the Turned Shoulder Plane. But so what? His Right Shoulder, Right Forearm, and Elbow are on Different Planes. But so What? He’s Hogan, he’ll get the ball to the target regardless of his poor geometry at this stage of his swing.

[Daryl]

I'd say the Right Forearm, indeed the entire RFFW ideally stays "on plane", so to speak, throughout the entire swing. But this is the plane of the Right Wrist Bend not to be confused with The Inclined Plane which the right forearm rides sometimes through impact say, but not always. So at top the RFFW is not on the Inclined Plane in Total Motion. Chipping maybe. See 6-B-3-0-1.

Ah ha. I see your problem. The Right Forearm stays aligned to the Swing Plane if you don't over bend the Right Elbow and you use a Rigid Power Package. Meaning that the Arms and Club are lifted by the Shoulder Sockets so the Alignments of the Right Forearm remain undisturbed within the Power Package after the takeaway and during the Backstroke. Then as your arms are lowered during the Hand Acceleration stage of the Downstroke, your Right Forearm comes back down to the Plane exactly how it was at the end of Startup.

[O.B.Left]

Have you any photos of this deal? Are you saying the right arm stays on the Inclined Plane or gets back on it quicker having left it at Top. The former is un golf like, a two stroke penalty in the UK, in Total Motion, no?

While your at it any photos of a golfer staying on a single non shifting fixed plane angle in total motion, un posed. I know you and Lynn say its doable, Homer wrote about it and thats all the proof I need but I cant find any photos. Moe came close but not quite. Hogan no. Brian Gay no. No point checking Johnny Miller. Mat Kutcher?

I aint trying to be a doofus, Im just thinking about all the site members in Missouri, the "show me state". They're always like this, you know.

[12 piece bucket]

What most seems missing is the idea that the Clubshaft Angle is the Plane Angle. Whatever the Angle of the Clubshaft, is the Plane angle. The Plane board should be set to the angle of the Clubshaft not the Clubshaft set to the Plane board. You should swing up and down the same angle of inclination of the Clubshaft. Your Hands and Grip control the Angle of the Clubshaft.

All of the various Plane Angles we talk about are reference points for the Clubshaft Angle. That Angle defines the Angle of the Plane.

Therefore, when at Impact, the Clubshaft extends through your waist where it's touched by your right elbow, then we say that the Clubshaft is on an Elbow Plane. If, at Impact, the Shaft Extends through the Location of your Right Shoulder where it was at the Top of your Backswing while using a Flat Backstroke Shoulder Turn, then we say that your Clubshaft is on a Turned Shoulder Plane.

The Quest, Nirvana, Valhalla, The Holy Grail, is to have a Swing where the Right Shoulder, Hands, Right Elbow, and Right Forearm are on the same Plane as the Clubshaft during Startdown; and at Release, the Hands Right Elbow and Right Forearm are on the same Plane as the Clubshaft for and through the Impact Interval as the Power Package Unfolds to Both Arms Straight. Curiously, this can ONLY occur if your Clubshaft angle is set to the Turned Shoulder Plane. But, unfortunately, even that’s not enough. You need a Hip Slide to help the Right Shoulder follow that plane during the Start of the Downstroke.

In the Picture above, Hogan appears to have his Clubshaft On Plane. However, it’s not the same plane he’ll have the Clubshaft on when the Ball is struck. I know this because his Right Elbow is Over-Bent and the Clubshaft Angle will flatten as he unfolds his Right Arm. Currently, his shaft is very close to the Turned Shoulder Plane. But so what? His Right Shoulder, Right Forearm, and Elbow are on Different Planes. But so What? He’s Hogan, he’ll get the ball to the target regardless of his poor geometry at this stage of his swing.

You're kidding right? Poor geometry? Hogan? Hogan pretty much matches the shaft plane as you have described above . . BUT . . . THE SHAFT PLANE AT ADDRESS IS FOR MOST IRRELEVANT . . . How many people actually match the shaft plane at address at impact??? You just said the be all end all was having the stuff whatever it was you said "on-plane" at start down . . .

[Daryl]

You're kidding right? Poor geometry? Hogan? Hogan pretty much matches the shaft plane as you have described above . . BUT . . . THE SHAFT PLANE AT ADDRESS IS FOR MOST IRRELEVANT . . . How many people actually match the shaft plane at address at impact??? You just said the be all end all was having the stuff whatever it was you said "on-plane" at start down . . .

Hmm? I said that the Clubshaft Plane at the Top of his Backswing is not the same Angle the Clubshaft will be when the Ball is struck.

Dear shocked Friend,

Maybe Poor was a bad choice of words. Let me rephrase it. "Hogans misalignment's were done on purpose."

Hogan had the best 3 inches in Golf. 1 inch before, during and after contact.

Golf is not a game of good shots. It's a game of bad shots. Ben Hogan

[Daryl]

Have you any photos of this deal? Are you saying the right arm stays on the Inclined Plane or gets back on it quicker having left it at Top. The former is un golf like, a two stroke penalty in the UK, in Total Motion, no?

While your at it any photos of a golfer staying on a single non shifting fixed plane angle in total motion, un posed. I know you and Lynn say its doable, Homer wrote about it and thats all the proof I need but I cant find any photos. Moe came close but not quite. Hogan no. Brian Gay no. No point checking Johnny Miller. Mat Kutcher?

I aint trying to be a doofus, Im just thinking about all the site members in Missouri, the "show me state". They're always like this, you know.

Address the Ball. Perform your Single Wrist Action Takeaway and Stop. Now, without bending your Elbows or Wrists, or Turning your Torso, moving your Legs or Hips or changing your waist bend; Raise your Hands Vertical from only the Shoulder Joints. That’s the Backstroke. Next…Lower the “Power Package” from the Shoulders. That’s the Downstroke. Please notice that your Right Forearm returned to precisely the same position where it was at the end of the Takeaway. Also, notice that your Right Elbow had moved away from your Torso during the Upswing and back to your torso during the Downswing. Your “Power Package Components” stayed on the same Plane. Your Hands, Clubshaft, Right Forearm, and Right Elbow moved vertically, simultaneously, and down again.
When your feet, knees, hips, torso, and shoulders move during the Backstroke, all of those alignments become fuzzy.
In addition, Bending and Unbending the Right Elbow, changes the Triangle. It increases or decreases the #1 or #4 Accumulators. The amount that the Left Arm Crosses the Chest.

Here is an experiment/demonstration to show you Right Elbow participation in the Golf Swing. This is a revelation.

Step 1: Clasp your hands and extend your arms out in front of you and level to the Ground. Bend your Right Elbow a few inches. Your Hands moved to the Right and your Elbow MOVED DOWNWARD with or without Extensor Action.. That’s the Takeaway. Keep them there for a minute while you perform Step two.

Now the Fun part. Options.

Step Two: You have TWO OPTIONS to move the Left Arm closer to the Chest.

A: HOGANS WAY Move your Hands to the Right and Allow the Right Elbow to BEND, with or without Extensor Action. This pulls the Left Arm across the Chest and ends with the Elbow at your Side. Your Left Arm is across your Chest and level with or Below Your Shoulders.

B: TGM Rather than continuing to Bend Your Right Elbow, you simply Raise your Hands from the Shoulder Sockets with or without Extensor Action. This Raises the Hands, Raises the Right Elbow, does not change the Right Elbow Bend and it Moves the Left Arm Across the Chest and Hands are WAY ABOVE the Right Shoulder.

Which way does this guy use? A or B?

[12 piece bucket]

3 inches . . . dude . . . club is RIGHT ON PLANE FROM DELIVERY ALL THE WAY THRU??? look at his hands from start down the exit all most identical . . .

You been sniffin' too many markers you draw on pictures with. . . did Mike O spend the night at your crizzo and slip you a roofy or something?

[Daryl]

3 inches . . . dude . . . club is RIGHT ON PLANE FROM DELIVERY ALL THE WAY THRU??? look at his hands from start down the exit all most identical . . .

You been sniffin' too many markers you draw on pictures with. . . did Mike O spend the night at your crizzo and slip you a roofy or something?

Ok, you win. 30 inches.

And ya, Mike O spent the night. But he wanted to sleep in the Barn with the Farm Animals. ??? He said something about "gettin closer with Nature"..

[O.B.Left]

Oh oh, here comes Kanye West again.............."Yo, Bucket , Daryl Im happy for Hogan an Imna let you finish but........Beyonce got the best 30 inches in golf OF ALL TIME".

[O.B.Left]

Address the Ball. Perform your Single Wrist Action Takeaway and Stop. Now, without bending your Elbows or Wrists, or Turning your Torso, moving your Legs or Hips or changing your waist bend; Raise your Hands Vertical from only the Shoulder Joints. That’s the Backstroke. Next…Lower the “Power Package” from the Shoulders. That’s the Downstroke. Please notice that your Right Forearm returned to precisely the same position where it was at the end of the Takeaway. Also, notice that your Right Elbow had moved away from your Torso during the Upswing and back to your torso during the Downswing. Your “Power Package Components” stayed on the same Plane. Your Hands, Clubshaft, Right Forearm, and Right Elbow moved vertically, simultaneously, and down again.
When your feet, knees, hips, torso, and shoulders move during the Backstroke, all of those alignments become fuzzy.
In addition, Bending and Unbending the Right Elbow, changes the Triangle. It increases or decreases the #1 or #4 Accumulators. The amount that the Left Arm Crosses the Chest.

Here is an experiment/demonstration to show you Right Elbow participation in the Golf Swing. This is a revelation.

Step 1: Clasp your hands and extend your arms out in front of you and level to the Ground. Bend your Right Elbow a few inches. Your Hands moved to the Right and your Elbow MOVED DOWNWARD with or without Extensor Action.. That’s the Takeaway. Keep them there for a minute while you perform Step two.

Now the Fun part. Options.

Step Two: You have TWO OPTIONS to move the Left Arm closer to the Chest.

A: HOGANS WAY Move your Hands to the Right and Allow the Right Elbow to BEND, with or without Extensor Action. This pulls the Left Arm across the Chest and ends with the Elbow at your Side. Your Left Arm is across your Chest and level with or Below Your Shoulders.

B: TGM Rather than continuing to Bend Your Right Elbow, you simply Raise your Hands from the Shoulder Sockets with or without Extensor Action. This Raises the Hands, Raises the Right Elbow, does not change the Right Elbow Bend and it Moves the Left Arm Across the Chest and Hands are WAY ABOVE the Right Shoulder.

Which way does this guy use? A or B?

D, what have you got against right elbow bending? I noticed you dont reach into your pockets much when the bill comes perhaps this all relates? An old football injury maybe?

You can not employ the Magic of the Right Forearm without bending the right elbow!!!! B is not TGM as I understand it anyways. OH and the Missourians want photos.