Hinge action question

[stevebayne]

My full swing I have been working on has a dual horizontal backswing and follow through. When I am chipping and pitching and want a vertical or angled hinge follow through would I use the same backswing as my full swing or should I match the hinge action going back with the follow through hinge action?
Thanks

[drewitgolf]

The Turn feel should match the Roll feel. With Vertical Hinging there is a reverse roll fee in Start Up.

[Daryti]

For hitting with vertical hinge, is it easier/requird to have an open stance with forearm pointing at plane line?

[innercityteacher]

Maybe it is because I'm a computer teacher and I work really hard to make abstract ideas concrete, but I am confused by the significance of the vertical hinge.

On one hand, Yoda says 'Throw it down and you'll like the effect on your shots'.


Then we have Daryl, a seemingly good dude saying:

I think that you are saying, that you discovered, that an accentuated Hip Slide causes you to create a more Downward Swing motion and that it causes a more downward throw-out of the Clubhead when the Left Wrist Uncocks.

If you'll pardon the analogy, I think that you and Yoda are in the same "Chapter" but not on the same "Page.

You're mistaking his video as a "Directive" to find a way of creating a Downward Blow. That's the first Mistake. The second mistake is thinking that the Pivot controls the Hands.

Then we have 12 Piece, another honorable, well, genuinely insightful golfer, saying:

f you want that ball to start right of the target and draw back to it . . . you better get the face OPEN more.

I'd suggest leaving that supination alone . . . work on your pivot and learn how the left wrist works. THE LEFT WRIST WORKS IN A HAMMERING MOTION . . . IF YOU ARCH . . . YOU CAN'T HAMMER. Isolate your left wrist . . . lift the clubhead up by cocking your left wrist in a vertical plane like you were going to hammer a nail into the ground vertically. That's how your left wrist works . . . that is the left forearm flying wedge . . . note if your grip is turned you will hammer and your wrist will bend and cock to keep the shaft in line with the left arm . . . that is RHYTHM . . . if you are UNCOCKING there is NO IMPETUS TO FLIP . . . YOU DON"T NEED THAT ARCHY STUFF.

Another thing is learn to pivot with proper geometry . . . don't move your head around . . . make sure that your left shoulder is far enough forward that you don't have to do some whacky stuff to get low point infront of the ball. If you are pivoting in a way that you can sustain the pivot lag and get your rotation going . .. you won't throw the club away . . . tie that in with an understanding of how the left wrist works (left arm flying wedge with it's rhythm . . .) you won't need to worry about that supination stuff.

Hogan may have done that supination stuff . . . but the bottom line is his pivot was so dynamic and he swung so much on plane that all that stuff happened . . . do you think with all that accumulator lag he was trying to hold on to the lag? HECK NO!!! He set a lot of angle . . . AND HE RELEASED IT . . . SLUNG IT DOWN OUT AND FORWARD AND THEN QUICKLY BACK UP AND IN ON PLANE . . . NO HANGING ON . . . that club was RIPPING DOWN PLANE AND BACK U

Leading me to the conclusion that the Vertical left hand is a way cool piece to the golfing puzzle useful for weddings, bat-mitzvahs, and all golfing contests. But, should I sling that wrist down like a madman or sort of "just know it's there?"

[Daryl]

Leading me to the conclusion that the Vertical left hand is a way cool piece to the golfing puzzle useful for weddings, bat-mitzvahs, and all golfing contests. But, should I sling that wrist down like a madman or sort of "just know it's there?"

Dear Innercityteacher,

Left Wrist Cock is the Second Power Accumulator. In Pivot Strokes, when using any other Release than "Sweep", the Cocked Left Wrist is Driven Downplane by the Power Package to your Release Point.

Yoda was saying that the Left Wrist Cocks and Uncocks in a Vertical Plane, Down-toward-the-Planeline not in a Horizontal Plane which is Forward-toward-the-target.

Bucket, bless him, said that the Wrist should remain Flat and not Arched while cocking or Uncocking and that retaining a Flat and Straight Primary Lever will facilitate Hinge Action - Rhythm.

Daryl said not to confuse the Pivots Downward Forces with the Uncocking of the Left Wrist. Pivot Drives the Power Package. CF or the #1 Accumulator Uncocks the Left Wrist. I further stated that if you learn this well, then you'll become healthier, younger looking, happier, better looking and with greatly enhanced sex appeal.

6-B-2-0 THE SECOND POWER ACCUMULATOR When the Left Wrist is Cocked (in excess of the selected Clubshaft-Left Hand Angle (6-B-3) in the Address Fix positions) it forms the Second Power Accumulator. It’s the true Velocity Accumulator because of the shortness of its travel time (during a Maximum Delay Release). Centrifugal Force, Accumulator #1, the muscles of both forearms, any – or all – are available to actuate this Assembly. Its “in-line” condition is FULL EXTENSION as determined by the Accumulator #3 requirements – if any. It is the “Downward” (Angle of Attack) Motion per 2-C-0 and 2-N-1.

6-B-2-A MAXIMUM POWER is obtained with maximum Controllable Hand Speed (10-19) and/or a sharp-breaking Line Delivery (7-23) and maximum Trigger Delay (10-20). Study 10-19 and 10-11-0-2.

6-B-2-B ZERO ACCUMULATION is obtained by not exceeding the selected #3 Accumulator Angle during either the Backstroke or the Downstroke.

6-B-2-C MAXIMUM TRIGGER DELAY is achieved by using an Automatic Snap or Flip Release (10-24-3 or –F).

Lastly, don't swing like a Madman.

[innercityteacher]

Wow! How did you know, Daryl, what I really look like? Did the decoder ring have a camera in it after all?

But seriously, I've never liked taking more than one (little blue pill ) each night!

More to the real point of your concise, logical post:

It’s the true Velocity Accumulator because of the shortness of its travel time (during a Maximum Delay Release). Centrifugal Force, Accumulator #1, the muscles of both forearms, any – or all – are available to actuate this Assembly. Its “in-line” condition is FULL EXTENSION as determined by the Accumulator #3 requirements – if any. It is the “Downward” (Angle of Attack) Motion per 2-C-0 and 2-N-1.

THEREFORE,I am going to actuate that assembly using the muscles of both forearms to FULL Extension and thus slinging it downward with vigor and great zeal!

Thanks Daryl, for being so informative and nice about my dementia!

Patrick

Dear Innercityteacher,

Left Wrist Cock is the Second Power Accumulator. In Pivot Strokes, when using any other Release than "Sweep", the Cocked Left Wrist is Driven Downplane by the Power Package to your Release Point.

Yoda was saying that the Left Wrist Cocks and Uncocks in a Vertical Plane, Down-toward-the-Planeline not in a Horizontal Plane which is Forward-toward-the-target.

Bucket, bless him, said that the Wrist should remain Flat and not Arched while cocking or Uncocking and that retaining a Flat and Straight Primary Lever will facilitate Hinge Action - Rhythm.

Daryl said not to confuse the Pivots Downward Forces with the Uncocking of the Left Wrist. Pivot Drives the Power Package. CF or the #1 Accumulator Uncocks the Left Wrist. I further stated that if you learn this well, then you'll become healthier, younger looking, happier, better looking and with greatly enhanced sex appeal.



Lastly, don't swing like a Madman.

[innercityteacher]

I will attempt to hit like Yoda or swing like Mr. Hogan. A big part of this is understanding my left wrist vertical hinge is going to be sent down, out and forward by whichever power package I employ, on plane, with gusto !

I will realize that as I do so, catching the ball before the bottom of my down, out and forward, will likely produce power and a draw (at least), and when catching the ball after the bottom of the motion, I will likely get a fade or slice with less power.

Thanks, Daryl!

Patrick

Wow! How did you know, Daryl, what I really look like? Did the decoder ring have a camera in it after all?

But seriously, I've never liked taking more than one (little blue pill ) each night!

More to the real point of your concise, logical post:

It’s the true Velocity Accumulator because of the shortness of its travel time (during a Maximum Delay Release). Centrifugal Force, Accumulator #1, the muscles of both forearms, any – or all – are available to actuate this Assembly. Its “in-line” condition is FULL EXTENSION as determined by the Accumulator #3 requirements – if any. It is the “Downward” (Angle of Attack) Motion per 2-C-0 and 2-N-1.

THEREFORE,I am going to actuate that assembly using the muscles of both forearms to FULL Extension and thus slinging it downward with vigor and great zeal!

Thanks Daryl, for being so informative and nice about my dementia!

Patrick

[Daryl]

The picture is me becoming frustrated unable to find or choose words to make my thoughts more clear. It often happens. Please don't think I meant it to be a picture of you. I'm the kind that thinks if you don't understand then it's my fault for not explaining it the right way. I'd hate to see someone go down the wrong path because of something I said.

[O.B.Left]

InnerCity

Id suggest that Yoda's video demonstration of an active vertical hammering done by the left WRIST (only) was an example of a Non Automatic Release Trigger. Homer believed the path to an Automatic Snap Release was via a Non Automatic Trigger. The common Swingers Non Auto Trigger being the Left Wrist Throw. 10-20-E

The advantage of this Active Vertical hammering is that it makes Horizontal motion less likely and also gives you more DOWN and therefore OUT. So less Steering and more In to Out on the Approach Angle. See 2-C-0.

The hacker typically tries to take the back of the ball right towards the hole , a misguided application of linear force. Logical but fatal for a side on game played with hooked clubs and a circular orbit. For balls played back of low point, most every shot therefore the ball is taken DOWN , OUT and FORWARD. For pure compression the Sweetspot on the clubface must stay in contact with the ball as if welded together and together they must travel Down and Out (to right field), the Inclined Plane demands it. The ball leaves at 90 degrees to the face at Separation meaning the face is Open at Impact. The geometry is not what everyone thinks it is at first.

The Active application of a Downward force will give you some Out given the Angled Plane..............a great thing for the new TGM er to add to his impact geometry. Add some Horizontal Hinging and voila! PUre compression.

Im wondering if this application of Downward force is best perceived as an On Plane force or a truly Downward force? Homer said that the On Plane travel of the Clubhead was a result of divergent forces after all. The Pivot providing the OUT, the Left Hand uncocking providing the DOWN etc etc . See the 2-N-1 Force Vectors.

Do we Hammer Down and just let the PIvot and CF take it along the Inclined Plane? Maybe Im talking crazy talk? Again.

City, with all due respect................we are taking thread jacking to new level again. Even Mike O. would disapprove and he is the ThreadMasta Jacka of all time. Future generations trying to archive our insights will have one heck of time unearthing these pearls of wisdom. We must protect our legacy for future generations , the Alignment Golfers who will follow us in this quest.

Why dont you start a thread on the Yoda video. There is a lot to discuss there. Lynn has added a wrinkle to the Throw, maybe, I think. A good one too. Or maybe he just asked Homer for clarification? I dunno.

[innercityteacher]

Basic Hinge stuff and thought, well...why not?

Patrick

InnerCity

Id suggest that Yoda's video demonstration of an active vertical hammering done by the left WRIST (only) was an example of a Non Automatic Release Trigger. Homer believed the path to an Automatic Snap Release was via a Non Automatic Trigger. The common Swingers Non Auto Trigger being the Left Wrist Throw. 10-20-E

The advantage of this Active Vertical hammering is that it makes Horizontal motion less likely and also gives you more DOWN and therefore OUT. So less Steering and more In to Out on the Approach Angle. See 2-C-0.

The hacker typically tries to take the back of the ball right towards the hole , a misguided application of linear force. Logical but fatal for a side on game played with hooked clubs and a circular orbit. For balls played back of low point, most every shot therefore the ball is taken DOWN , OUT and FORWARD. For pure compression the Sweetspot on the clubface must stay in contact with the ball as if welded together and together they must travel Down and Out (to right field), the Inclined Plane demands it. The ball leaves at 90 degrees to the face at Separation meaning the face is Open at Impact. The geometry is not what everyone thinks it is at first.

The Active application of a Downward force will give you some Out given the Angled Plane..............a great thing for the new TGM er to add to his impact geometry. Add some Horizontal Hinging and voila! PUre compression.

Im wondering if this application of Downward force is best perceived as an On Plane force or a truly Downward force? Homer said that the On Plane travel of the Clubhead was a result of divergent forces after all. The Pivot providing the OUT, the Left Hand uncocking providing the DOWN etc etc . See the 2-N-1 Force Vectors.

Do we Hammer Down and just let the PIvot and CF take it along the Inclined Plane? Maybe Im talking crazy talk? Again.

City, with all due respect................we are taking thread jacking to new level again. Even Mike O. would disapprove and he is the ThreadMasta Jacka of all time. Future generations trying to archive our insights will have one heck of time unearthing these pearls of wisdom. We must protect our legacy for future generations , the Alignment Golfers who will follow us in this quest.

Why dont you start a thread on the Yoda video. There is a lot to discuss there. Lynn has added a wrinkle to the Throw, maybe, I think. A good one too. Or maybe he just asked Homer for clarification? I dunno.