Arrow Out of Quiver
 

10-19-C ...Start the Club down as though it were being drawn from a quiver like an arrow-feathered end first. Maintain this motion until the Release switches ends. This is possible only if, and for as long as, Inertia can hold the clubhead inside the arc of the Hands or hold to a Line Delivery Path (2-L). Centrifugal Force will set in when the Clubhead crosses to the outside and it will begin to pull into its own incidental orbit per 2-P and 2-K#5. Then further acceleration can be applied only at Pressure Point #1 to support the Pull on the Clubshaft-especially for Short Shot Power.

I can understand now how "an arrow out of is drawn out of a quiver" with the swing of early Hogan I made. Please share what Homer meant by the words in bold.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gj_GVe61LZo

Does that mean on plane uncocking?

thanks

KOC

I will venture a guess at what Homer meant. Knowledgeable TGMers can correct me if I am wrong.

Homer talks of the release switching ends. That presumably happens after the delivery position when the release phenomenon happens. Prior to that point in the downswing, the clubhead is in inside the arc of the hands, but after release (at approximately the delivery position) the clubhead is outside the hands - as demonstrated in this photo of Badds.



This image shows the clubhead being inside the hand arc (when the clubshaft is in line with the right forearm), and then moving outside the hand arc due to the release phenomenon.

After release (due to release of power accumulator #2) the clubshaft is accelerating due to centrifugal action, and a swinger can no longer get the clubshaft to travel faster due to muscle power "pushing" the clubshaft forward at the grip end. A swinger can only use right arm/forearm muscle power to apply "push" pressure at the grip end of the clubshaft (specifically at PP#1) to support the "pull" action already in play due to the release of power accumulator #4.

Interestingly, Homer used the word "acceleration" in that last sentence, and it is not clear to me whether he is referring to acceleration of the clubhead or acceleration of the hands. If he is referring to acceleration of the clubhead, then I do not understand how this is possible, because according to Homer's endless belt analogy, maximum clubhead speed is attained at the start of the release and not necessarily at impact. I, therefore, presume that he is referring to acceleration of the hands. However, even this point is interestingly mootable, because this graph shows that the arms decelerate prior to impact.



Interestingly, according to nmgolfer's mathematical explanation of the release phenomenon, the clubshaft can constantly accelerate all the way to impact, even if hand speed remains constant or decreases - as long as the club can acquire further angular acceleration due to the hand "pull" force being at an angle to the COG of the club.

Jeff.

KOC Utube Hogan
 

KOC, I sure enjoyed the Utube video that you linked to.
If someone could put up the still frames on this post, I
know that everybody would enjoy the frames. I would do
it but don't know how.

Thanks again, Donn

Awesome vid, KOC. You have a great gift in preparing all those vids, and I mean it.

The question is - is the arrow being drawn from a quiver by his right arm or left one ? or maybe both ? As my opinion goes - it's definitely a right arm motion, the same one Pistol was talking about in his posts.

Cheers

Dariusz

According to TGM teaching it cannot possibly be the right arm. Pulling an arrow out of a quiver is a mental concept for swingers, and a swinger pulls the grip end of the club along its longitudinal axis with his left hand. The right arm/forearm can only apply pressure to the left thumb at PP#1, and cannot directly pull on the club. The right hand can sense clubhead lag pressure at PP#3, but it doesn't apply any active force at PP#3.

Jeff.

Jeff, what arm does a right-handed archer use while pulling an arrow out of a quiver ? ;)

Cheers

Dariusz,

You are welcome! World is big, but golfers who love Ben Hogan and Golfing Machine are all around.

Good question to Jeff here…. Left or Right? My GSEM friend in Hong Kong also asked me your same question when he saw the clip.

First of all, let me state that I am not a science student during my schooling and actual don’t know much theory of physics; biomechanics; kinetics. But I seriously to find the answer out of the mat...

When I try to hit a ball only with the right arm in pretty slow motion, in such a case I bring the club back to the top and stop, sensing the weight of the club at the first knuckle of the forefinger. From there, I can really swing my right arm to hit the ball with good contact…but the sensing the club weight got lost very soon…

Or at the top, my educated hand, in this case only my right hand, with the ultimate mission of sensing the clubhead lags pressure, my body NEEDS to do something to accomplish the mission. So from the ground up, my hip slides, right shoulder move down plane with 2nd axis tilt…and all of a sudden, the clubhead contacts the ball crisply. I try consciously doing nothing with my right arm and hand but something did change…I notice the straightening of right arm and a bit flattening of the right wrist at release point.

The above seems like to me what Hogan said about the free ride and then the later stage of 3 right hands

How about the left arm? I believe it is definite not an independent pull as the left arm is to be swung, inert, to have master accumulator lag.

When left and right all together, now my 3 iron went over 200y and my Driver went over 270 for an inch shorter than the Man.

Homer made a statement: The "mystery" of the Mechanics of Golf fades away when Right Arm participation is understood. Does this “mystery” really fade away for so many years in golfdom? There are Gary E. takes Hogan as right-sided model, and of course others as left-sided model…will this story end?

Of course, I just share some videos and what I did in the past 6 months. I can be totally wrong but I really feel great with my ball stroking and scores lately.:golfcart:

Dariusz
This debate will probably be endless and i am apt to post as once again Jeff has stated that you can't do it according to interpretation of the book.
From my point of view i don't see this concept as anything to do with pulling the club along the longitudenal axis i see it as a concept to fold the right elbow and put it in a deep pitch position plus feeling the weight of the clubhead.In regard to this video of an early Hogan his left arm is much much higher and one could conceivably imagine he is reaching back with his left hand to remove the arrow but later his left arm was much lower and not close to his shoulder at all so the different position would seem difficult to imagine his left hand removing the arrow

Great posts, KOC and Pistol, and a great food for further thoughts about Hogan's swing principles.

Cheers